Not a day goes by without one of Fleet Street's finest passing comment on things down at Liverpool, and this time it's Des Kelly in the Daily Mail.

It's got to be said that he has a point, after Rafa - manager of Liverpool let's not forget - claimed that winning trophies isn't everything. Isn't that exactly what Liverpool are about?

Liverpool supporters keep saying it, Rafa Benitez can’t help but plead for it, and practically everyone seems to agree that this football lark shouldn’t be judged in the simple black and white of winning and losing.

But here are the statistics that matter: one win in eight games, currently placed sixth in the table and with distant hopes of avoiding Champions League ignominy reliant on the results of others.

It could explain why Benitez says: ‘I don’t agree with people when they say you have to win trophies.’

How things have changed. There was a time when success at Liverpool was about nothing else but winning trophies; it was ingrained in their culture.